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Hey, it's Rachel Cook, your Modern Mentor.
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I'm the founder of Lead Above Noise,
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where we help leaders build the skills, the capability,
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and the confidence to activate their team's fullest
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performance while maintaining their employee engagement.
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We run bootcamps, we deliver keynotes,
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and we run pulse checks to help you build blueprints
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to move forward.
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If you have any curiosity for you
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or your organization, send me a note at
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rachel@leadabovenoise.com.
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Hey, real quick, before we jump into today's
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episode, can I ask a favor?
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If you are a regular listener of Modern Mentor
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or even an occasional one
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and you have something to say about the show,
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I'd love it if you'd leave a quick rating
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or review in your podcast app.
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It's kind of the best way
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to help the show find new listeners
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and couldn't we all use a boost at work anyway, onto today,
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it's a winner because I got to interview the great
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Danielle Hughes, chief Personality Officer
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of More Than Words Copy.
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And we did a deep dive on how
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to really z up your LinkedIn profile, your presence,
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your brand, the whole shebang,
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whether you are seeking a new job, a promotion,
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or some new connections, whatever it is.
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Danielle's got you covered. Danielle's often referred to
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as a magician with words,
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and while she can't pull a rabbit out of her hat,
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she can hone your brand message.
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And of course you can learn more about her on LinkedIn
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or at her website at more than words copy.com.
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Okay, here we go.
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Danielle Hughes, chief Personality Officer, welcome
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to the Modern Mentor Podcast.
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I'm so happy to have you here.
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I'm so happy to be here. Thank you so much, Rachel. Oh,
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It's my pleasure.
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I have been really looking forward to this conversation
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because you are a lovingly loud voice in my ears when it
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comes to personal branding, but,
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but you have a little bit of a different take on
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it, which I'm excited about.
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Um, personal branding in the context
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of the professional world.
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A lot of stuff about LinkedIn
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and LinkedIn is, is certainly where I hang out.
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I know a lot of my audience hangs out there.
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A lot of people have a lot of questions about
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how do we use it, how do we show up on it, how do we use it
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to find a job, to build our brand, to do all of the things.
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And so I am excited to cover a lot of ground with you today.
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Thank you. I love lovingly loud.
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That is, I have never heard that before
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and it feels very apt and I like that so much.
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Thank you, .
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My pleasure. Alright, so let's go ahead and get started.
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You talk about this concept
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that you call a genuine personality brand
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and there are a lot
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of people talking about personality brands these days.
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So tell us what your take is on that.
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Yeah, so to me, I'm a copywriter by trade.
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I've spent my whole career in copywriting
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and marketing and branding.
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And when I first heard the term personal brand,
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it never made sense to me.
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And even as a raging extrovert, it, you know,
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the word personal means private.
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So, and yet the concept
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of personal brand is sharing everything with everyone.
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So there's a complete disconnect between the meaning
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of the word and what it's become.
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And I think as business and your professional brand
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and messaging has evolved over these past,
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like let's say 10 years, people have felt this pressure
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that it's an all or nothing.
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That in order to add something and,
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and fuse their personal brand into their professional
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message, they have to basically, you know,
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open up the closet and share all the dirty secrets.
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And I always felt like our personality is who we are
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and that's what allows us to foster connection
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and build relationships.
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And so I said, you know,
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it's not personal branding personality
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because in in the workspace you have to showcase some of
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who you are and otherwise you're not gonna get noticed.
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You're not gonna get attention,
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you're not gonna find the right connections
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for advancement, all of those things.
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And so I just felt like that gives people a guardrail
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and a boundary and it's like, I don't need
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to know everything about you,
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but what are you comfortable sharing
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and how is that gonna help you
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feel more comfortable showing up as yourself
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and forge those necessary connections?
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Really, really nicely said.
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And I do think that there is this conversation in the ether
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right now about, you know, finding the balance point
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between being vulnerable and being authentic,
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but not oversharing and do I still have a right to privacy?
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And of course the answer is yes.
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And so I think a lot of people are struggling with that.
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So, good, I'm excited to delve in a little bit deeper. Thank
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You.
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And I think some people are naturally
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more willing to be vulnerable.
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Mm-hmm . And I also think there's another word,
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like there's levels of vulnerability.
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You know, I think we were just talking offline
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and I mentioned how I had a workshop this week
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and I had a lot of technical problems
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and it went very poorly for the first like 15 minutes.
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And I lost my, you know, what, uh, my mind .
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And um, and then I shared a video on Instagram
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and it was the most commented video I've probably posted in
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a year because I was like, I effed up
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and here's what happened.
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And people relate to that.
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And that's not normally my thing,
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but it's the kind of stuff that generates I think a lot
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of goodwill and people just wanna know
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that we're all not perfect and we all make mistakes.
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And that is very consoling to to, to people in business.
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Yeah, I, I couldn't agree more.
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I, um, you know, some, some years ago,
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'cause this feels like a relevant story,
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I had brought my dog to the groomer and maybe an hour
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or two later I got a call from the groomer
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who was totally panicked.
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They had like nicked my dog,
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but they had taken her to the vet
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and they had her bandaged up and,
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and they were gonna take her bed, they were gonna come
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to my house and pick her up the next day
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to take her to a follow-up appointment.
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And they were so terrified to tell me this story.
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And I, I remember I said to her, listen,
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like making mistakes is human.
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It's about how do you, how did you handle it, right?
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How did you come back it?
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And sometimes I think that the best way to,
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I'm not suggesting that we make mistakes in our
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with intention, but I think a lot of us,
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when we make any sort of mistake, it's our instinct to,
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to hide it and, you know, to sweep it under the rug
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because we wanna show up as perfect and polish,
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but when we can show up as accountable and <inaudible>
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and to make sure we're, we're doing the right thing
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and we've learned so it won't happen again.
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I think there's a lot of of fuel that that gives us.
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Agreed. And it helps. I'm a control freak.
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So of course realizing that I could not control
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that there was everything that happened was completely
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beyond my control no matter what I did.
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It doesn't make it better , just as a reminder
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that sometimes you just gotta let go
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and everyone will forgive you.
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And it's how you rebound that is the most important thing.
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Totally. So I would love to get your take, Danielle.
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You know, one of the things that is coming up in
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conversations all over the place for me these days
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with clients, with friends, with whomever it may be,
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I feel like a lot of people are
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struggling in some ways at work.
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They're struggling with, I don't know, they're,
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they're bored, they're disconnected, they're lonely.
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It's blah, do I need a new job? Do I not need a new job?
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Um, and so I just, I wanna get a little bit
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of your hot take on this.
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I, I'm a big believer that whether
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or not you're actively looking for a job,
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I think it's always important to be cultivating your, uh,
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your online presence
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and your offline presence at any given time, right?
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So talk
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to us a little bit about why incorporating your personality
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into your professional branding is really important today in
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in the workplace, in the job market, wherever you may be.
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Yeah, and I think you kind
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of hit the nail on your head when you talked about there's a
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lot of people feeling a lot of different emotions
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and things about the workplace and their workplace
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and that all speaks to the culture.
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And you know, how did you, how did you take this job?
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How did you end up in this culture?
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Was it even ever the right fit for you?
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And I think a lot of the times, one of the reasons
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that a role might not be right for someone
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or an organization might not be right for someone is
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because they have a resume that just sort
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of matches the job description and they have all the skills,
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but they haven't taken to account
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what the environment is gonna be like
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and whether their personality
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and who they are as a person is going
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to fit into that environment.
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And it's a both end. You know, the company has to be
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as candid about what it's like there, as well
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as the person has to understand
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if this is the right fit for them.
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And you know, look, I know a lot
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of us, it's like we just need a job.
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And so sometimes you can't be choosy.
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But I also think the more you move up the ladder,
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the more you should be more, um, intentional about
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where you end up.
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And if you show an aspect of who you are,
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like in your LinkedIn profile, in your elevator pitch,
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when you're having conversations with hiring managers
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and recruiters, that's gonna instantly be, you know,
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a yes or a no, right?
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Is this person someone that's gonna fit here?
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Do we vibe or is this the complete wrong fit?
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And I don't think there's anything wrong with that.
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And I think yes, you're gonna narrow down your choices,
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but that's for the best because it's like dating, right?
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You're gonna narrow down.
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We don't need to be dating all the people.
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Let's pick a couple people we really like.
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Let's spend some time with them until we pick the one.
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And you can't just pick the one based on a list of traits
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that are on their dating profile.
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You have to get to know them,
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you have to ask them questions.
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And so it's the same thing with your professional brand.
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How do you express, you know, what type
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of environment's gonna be best for you?
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Are you someone who needs like a remote work
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because you do well on your own?
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Are you someone who thrives being around a lot
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of like action and opportunity?
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Are you a hand raiser? Are you an observer?
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All of these things are so vital and valid
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and I think the more that we admit that we have
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to share these things, the more likely we are
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to find the company that values that
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and then that's gonna let us do our best work.
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Because if you are not being able to be yourself,
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you're never gonna be able to do your best work.
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Yeah. Really nicely said.
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I, I think it is incredibly important to really
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evaluate the, the situation
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that you're considering stepping into, not getting
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so lost in the, oh, they made an offer,
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they want me mm-hmm um, that's great,
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but taking the time to ask, do I want them,
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do I think I will thrive here?
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Do I have a, a good gut feeling about it? Yeah. And
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Also getting found, right?
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Like set up your bio
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and your profile to get found by the right companies,
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not just to get found by everyone
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because you're so generic
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that you fit every description, right?
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So there has to be a focus on
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what message are you sending out there to get found
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and then how do you reiterate that same message, right?
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It should be cohesive.
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So your resume and your LinkedIn and your elevator pitch
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and all that in the interview should all be reiterating the,
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the same thing because we want people to say like, oh,
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they're exactly what I expected.
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So talk to us a little bit about that.
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Then talk about, so great, I,
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I know a little bit about myself, I know the version
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of myself I wanna put out there.
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How do I think about crafting a LinkedIn profile
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that tells potential employers that,
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So it, you have to think about what are you most proud
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of in your career, right?
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What are the things that you wanna shine a light on
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and what are the things you want to do future focused?
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So, so many of us, you know, write these profiles like I,
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you know, I did this, then I did this, then I did this,
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then it's just this like laundry list.
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But half the time the things
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that we've done in the past are no longer relevant
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or we don't wanna do them or we've outgrown them.
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And so it's a real like, serious focus on
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what are the few things
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that I have accomplished in my career,
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how do I share them in a way that's going
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to highlight my role in those things?
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And then what is it that I'm looking for so
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that it also sets me up for what's next.
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So of course we have to think about, you know,
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in your title you wanna think about what are the keywords
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and search terms that I want to be found for.
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But also like I always tell my clients, gimme
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that little fun hobby
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or just something at the end of that title
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that just lets me know you're a human being
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and you have outside interests.
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And then potentially you can even weave
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that into your narrative.
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So, um, I can give you some examples if you want to kind
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of understand like what that could look like.
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I work a lot with people in product and tech
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and one of the things that you assume
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is everybody's the same, right?
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Everybody's very technical, former engineers, a lot
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of software developers, right?
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They're very like detail oriented, very data, very analytic.
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And you think, okay, all these people,
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they're all product managers, like a thousand million
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of them, they all sound the same.
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But of course that's nothing can be further from the truth.
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'cause each person has a different story.
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Where did they come from? Why do they love this?
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Why did they get into this?
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And so what do you weave in that showcases not just like
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that you're a great product manager, but how you think
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and why you are so good at a certain aspect of that.
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So for example, I had a client who um,
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was telling me he's a big survivor fan, the reality show,
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and I'm a huge, I've seen every season,
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but one, so also a super fan
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and he puts on this event every year with his family
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for like 20 years.
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He's been doing Family Survivor every summer,
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gets all these friends together to do this event.
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And so first of all, I think that's so fun
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and so interesting, but what we talked about
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why we both love this show is the psychology of people
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of teamwork of all right, you have
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to outright outlast and outplay.
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And so when he's working in product
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and he's building products, that's what he said, he's like,
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he thinks of it like survivor, like
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that you've got the end goal in mind, which is to win.
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How do you get there? Who do you need
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to align yourself with, right?
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Who do you need to partner with
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in order to make that happen?
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What are the steps you need to take?
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And it was such an amazing marriage of those two passions.
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And of course like his intro is so compelling
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and now somebody who's hiring him is like, oh,
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I understand exactly how he thinks.
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And now you have a visual in your brain of
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who this person is, but you also know something about him,
348
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but it's relevant to what he does professionally.
349
00:14:56.805 --> 00:14:59.565
I love that. That is such a great connection.
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And you know, one of the things that I always tell people is
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we get to own our own story.
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We get to own our narrative.
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So your, your resume is not,
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and I think this is what you're saying,
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your resume is not just a set of like facts and dates
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and activities, but you get to craft the story around,
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you know, what, what you pulled through that like, I,
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I will just share quickly for myself.
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I, many, many years ago,
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I spent a few years working in an operations management
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capacity in a distribution center.
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So I worked on a warehouse floor, I managed a group
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of 50 people, mostly men who worked on assembly lines.
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And I wanted to make the transition into corporate hr.
365
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And that was on paper that did not make sense at all.
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That I was leaving a job that are
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where I was wearing steel toed boots and a and a hard hat.
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And I wanted to step into this corporate world.
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But the way that I positioned it to my next employer
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where I did work in corporate HR was I said, listen,
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I was on that warehouse floor.
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I was responsible for everything from conveyor
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to technology to people.
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And what made me really good at the
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job was the people part of it.
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I was not ant in the conveyors in the vehicles,
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in the inventory management system.
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I was excellent at hiring the right people at training them,
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at learning to trust them.
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And so I was able to craft that story
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to help become my platform into hr.
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Whereas a lot of my former colleagues who had
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that same job stayed in the operations world.
384
00:16:27.545 --> 00:16:31.485
Yes. And so I really do think there's something to how you,
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like what threads of the narrative you pull out
386
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and what you choose to highlight.
387
00:16:35.705 --> 00:16:37.445
Yes. And I think you hit the nail on the head with like,
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you own your story and I think so many of us forget
389
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that we are in control.
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And that goes back to like
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personality brand versus personal.
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Like we're in control of what we share of,
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and I always tell people, of course it has to be truthful.
394
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Like we're not pretending
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that we had experience that we don't have.
396
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But there's a way to position different experiences
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to serve your future goal.
398
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You know, if even for people who had, you know,
399
00:17:00.365 --> 00:17:02.925
career breaks, like if you took a break, if you're,
400
00:17:02.945 --> 00:17:03.965
you know, we're a stay at home mom
401
00:17:03.965 --> 00:17:05.405
and you were managing your whole household,
402
00:17:05.515 --> 00:17:07.485
that is a skill if you wanna go into the
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00:17:07.485 --> 00:17:08.645
workforce and portray that.
404
00:17:08.665 --> 00:17:10.245
If you were on the PTA
405
00:17:10.245 --> 00:17:12.045
or you did something with your kid's school,
406
00:17:12.585 --> 00:17:14.645
if you took care of someone, all
407
00:17:14.645 --> 00:17:17.925
of these things you volunteer anything, it doesn't matter
408
00:17:17.925 --> 00:17:21.325
that you weren't compensated with money, you learned a skill
409
00:17:21.385 --> 00:17:23.405
and you were compensated with experience
410
00:17:23.545 --> 00:17:27.445
and how you talk tell that story is of course what's going
411
00:17:27.445 --> 00:17:29.005
to hopefully get you to the next step.
412
00:17:29.675 --> 00:17:31.565
Totally. I love that. Thank you.
413
00:17:36.065 --> 00:17:37.325
So let's talk a little bit,
414
00:17:37.415 --> 00:17:39.725
we're we'll hang out on LinkedIn a little longer
415
00:17:40.085 --> 00:17:41.645
'cause seems to be the place.
416
00:17:42.305 --> 00:17:44.005
Um, so like I said and,
417
00:17:44.065 --> 00:17:46.525
and we are recording this at the beginning of a new year
418
00:17:46.745 --> 00:17:50.525
and I think a lot of people tend to take this moment to
419
00:17:51.485 --> 00:17:53.045
reconsider their current role.
420
00:17:53.055 --> 00:17:54.765
Maybe it's time to look for something new.
421
00:17:55.465 --> 00:17:57.285
Um, so for anybody listening
422
00:17:57.305 --> 00:18:00.285
who is thinking about getting ready for a job search,
423
00:18:00.675 --> 00:18:02.605
what strategies would you recommend that they make
424
00:18:02.625 --> 00:18:05.485
to their profiles to really stand out to recruiters?
425
00:18:05.565 --> 00:18:06.845
I know we've touched on a little bit of it,
426
00:18:06.905 --> 00:18:08.325
but what else would you add to that?
427
00:18:08.915 --> 00:18:10.885
Yeah, I mean I think again, like re
428
00:18:11.065 --> 00:18:13.525
so a few things you need to remember is
429
00:18:13.525 --> 00:18:16.805
that LinkedIn rewards content and it rewards engagement.
430
00:18:17.305 --> 00:18:19.525
So before you even start doing anything,
431
00:18:19.785 --> 00:18:23.525
go take a look at your profile, make sure that title up top
432
00:18:24.305 --> 00:18:25.965
so you get 220 characters
433
00:18:26.005 --> 00:18:27.405
there, what are you putting in there?
434
00:18:27.435 --> 00:18:28.485
What is it telling someone?
435
00:18:28.745 --> 00:18:29.685
If you're currently working,
436
00:18:29.905 --> 00:18:31.085
you need to have your current title.
437
00:18:31.665 --> 00:18:33.765
And then what are other words and search terms
438
00:18:33.905 --> 00:18:36.725
and what are things about you that you want other employers
439
00:18:36.725 --> 00:18:38.445
to know about you and find you for?
440
00:18:38.835 --> 00:18:42.365
That could be your industry, it could be um, you know,
441
00:18:42.445 --> 00:18:43.805
a mantra or a thought process you have.
442
00:18:43.905 --> 00:18:46.565
It could be the types of work that you do.
443
00:18:47.425 --> 00:18:49.525
Um, so get that optimized.
444
00:18:49.825 --> 00:18:52.685
The about section you get 2,600 characters,
445
00:18:53.055 --> 00:18:54.965
which everyone's like, who's gonna read that?
446
00:18:55.345 --> 00:18:57.565
It doesn't matter. Most people are not gonna read it.
447
00:18:58.025 --> 00:19:01.205
But again, the content could get searched by bots and found.
448
00:19:01.345 --> 00:19:02.765
So again, that's your only place
449
00:19:02.765 --> 00:19:05.045
to tell your narrative story, right?
450
00:19:05.045 --> 00:19:06.405
You don't need to reiterate your resume
451
00:19:06.405 --> 00:19:07.525
because it's already there.
452
00:19:07.945 --> 00:19:10.165
So how do you tell your story in a compelling way?
453
00:19:10.945 --> 00:19:14.045
Um, and I would say then start like working on your
454
00:19:14.045 --> 00:19:15.085
connections as well.
455
00:19:15.195 --> 00:19:17.645
Like who, if you are getting ready for the job search,
456
00:19:18.135 --> 00:19:19.645
start thinking about who could
457
00:19:19.645 --> 00:19:20.965
connect you to the right roles.
458
00:19:21.545 --> 00:19:23.925
You know, blanketing, just applying to jobs
459
00:19:24.185 --> 00:19:26.365
of course is just not gonna be meaningful
460
00:19:26.865 --> 00:19:29.525
and LinkedIn is so valuable when you realize you have a
461
00:19:29.525 --> 00:19:31.205
second connection who now works at the
462
00:19:31.205 --> 00:19:32.245
company you're interested in.
463
00:19:32.265 --> 00:19:34.405
And so how do you start warming people up?
464
00:19:34.945 --> 00:19:37.405
But you want to have a profile that you are proud
465
00:19:37.425 --> 00:19:38.565
to send people to.
466
00:19:39.785 --> 00:19:41.605
And so having, you know,
467
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and having a photo that looks like you at the top that is
468
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not in your car or not, you know, wearing a puffy coat,
469
00:19:49.165 --> 00:19:50.365
have a professional headshot.
470
00:19:50.395 --> 00:19:51.925
Like you think these things are obvious,
471
00:19:52.105 --> 00:19:53.765
but believe me, I have seen
472
00:19:54.345 --> 00:19:56.485
things from people who've been working for years
473
00:19:56.705 --> 00:19:58.325
and I just think we don't remember
474
00:19:58.325 --> 00:20:00.645
that this is your digital first impression.
475
00:20:01.145 --> 00:20:04.085
And so everything on this page needs to be setting you up
476
00:20:04.665 --> 00:20:05.965
to seem like somebody
477
00:20:05.965 --> 00:20:07.445
that this company wants to get to know.
478
00:20:07.875 --> 00:20:11.885
Okay. So in terms of profile, you wanna make sure
479
00:20:11.885 --> 00:20:13.805
that you look professional,
480
00:20:13.805 --> 00:20:15.565
you look like you've taken yourself seriously.
481
00:20:15.745 --> 00:20:17.005
We wanna make sure that you
482
00:20:17.005 --> 00:20:18.525
Look like you currently are as well.
483
00:20:18.705 --> 00:20:21.445
So like for men, like with your facial hair on point
484
00:20:21.445 --> 00:20:22.725
for women, if you're coloring your hair,
485
00:20:22.725 --> 00:20:24.885
you're not coloring your hair like it needs to be recent.
486
00:20:25.835 --> 00:20:30.165
Okay. That seems totally fair. Yeah. . Um, all right.
487
00:20:30.165 --> 00:20:32.085
And we've talked a little bit about your,
488
00:20:32.475 --> 00:20:33.925
your title or your headline.
489
00:20:33.925 --> 00:20:36.685
We've talked about your summary highlighting the pieces
490
00:20:36.705 --> 00:20:38.165
of your story that you wanna tell.
491
00:20:38.225 --> 00:20:39.805
We talked a little bit about just
492
00:20:39.805 --> 00:20:40.845
knowing that there are bots.
493
00:20:40.985 --> 00:20:44.485
So is that, was that an indication to use certain keywords?
494
00:20:44.545 --> 00:20:46.445
Is there, is there a yes,
495
00:20:47.025 --> 00:20:48.025
Yes.
496
00:20:48.025 --> 00:20:50.085
I mean, and again, we don't need to go crazy here,
497
00:20:50.785 --> 00:20:52.925
but what are the roles you're applying for
498
00:20:53.105 --> 00:20:54.525
and what's in the job description?
499
00:20:54.525 --> 00:20:55.725
And we don't need to match it
500
00:20:55.725 --> 00:20:58.565
because most job descriptions are jargon filled nonsense
501
00:20:58.565 --> 00:21:00.085
that don't say anything meaningful.
502
00:21:00.905 --> 00:21:02.885
But there needs to probably be certain
503
00:21:03.045 --> 00:21:04.405
keywords and terms, right?
504
00:21:04.465 --> 00:21:06.605
So what is your title currently
505
00:21:06.625 --> 00:21:08.645
and are you looking for a similar title or,
506
00:21:08.665 --> 00:21:11.005
and if not, can you put something
507
00:21:11.005 --> 00:21:13.405
and you put the industry, if you're in finance, put finance,
508
00:21:13.545 --> 00:21:16.525
put banking, put FinTech, put HR right?
509
00:21:16.585 --> 00:21:17.885
And spell these things out,
510
00:21:18.345 --> 00:21:20.805
that's gonna help you get found by the bots.
511
00:21:20.945 --> 00:21:22.445
And I always say it's a delegate dance
512
00:21:22.605 --> 00:21:24.605
'cause we have to get found but then we have
513
00:21:24.605 --> 00:21:26.165
to get invited for the interview.
514
00:21:26.465 --> 00:21:28.405
So you need to be interesting enough to get invited
515
00:21:28.585 --> 00:21:30.405
but you have to have some of the right keywords
516
00:21:30.405 --> 00:21:31.885
and to even be found in the first place.
517
00:21:32.765 --> 00:21:35.845
Absolutely. Thank you. Okay, so that's really helpful.
518
00:21:36.245 --> 00:21:38.325
I guess I would describe that as kind of the inbound.
519
00:21:38.385 --> 00:21:40.405
So that's how you get correct found, that's
520
00:21:40.405 --> 00:21:42.085
how you get discovered, that's how you invited.
521
00:21:42.945 --> 00:21:46.245
You also said um, LinkedIn rewards,
522
00:21:46.555 --> 00:21:48.005
content and engagement.
523
00:21:48.305 --> 00:21:51.165
Yes. And that in my mind is kind of the outbound, right?
524
00:21:51.165 --> 00:21:53.205
That's sort of the what you do, what you put out there.
525
00:21:53.235 --> 00:21:54.925
Correct. Um, talk
526
00:21:54.925 --> 00:21:56.965
to us a little bit about different approaches
527
00:21:56.965 --> 00:21:59.085
that people might take to to both of those things.
528
00:21:59.555 --> 00:22:01.365
Yeah, and I think, you know, it's so funny
529
00:22:01.565 --> 00:22:03.965
'cause I worked with someone and like we updated his profile
530
00:22:04.585 --> 00:22:06.645
and like it had been months and he wrote back
531
00:22:06.645 --> 00:22:09.085
and said, Hey, I'm not getting any leads, any inbounds.
532
00:22:09.085 --> 00:22:10.605
So I went over and I looked at his LinkedIn
533
00:22:11.145 --> 00:22:13.365
and I was like, oh, you have not posted on
534
00:22:13.365 --> 00:22:14.405
this platform in three months.
535
00:22:14.705 --> 00:22:16.085
Of course you're not gonna get anything
536
00:22:16.245 --> 00:22:17.885
'cause they're not showing you to anyone.
537
00:22:18.625 --> 00:22:20.805
So you don't have to post if
538
00:22:20.805 --> 00:22:22.805
that is not something you're comfortable with
539
00:22:22.865 --> 00:22:24.325
or you're not sure what to share.
540
00:22:24.985 --> 00:22:29.165
But LinkedIn will reward thoughtful commenting.
541
00:22:29.665 --> 00:22:31.045
So what do I mean by thoughtful?
542
00:22:31.265 --> 00:22:34.165
Not just congratulations Rachel on a job, right?
543
00:22:34.515 --> 00:22:37.205
Something that is adding to the conversation.
544
00:22:37.345 --> 00:22:39.685
So if somebody in your feed has posted an article
545
00:22:39.685 --> 00:22:41.845
that you think is interesting, can you comment on that
546
00:22:41.845 --> 00:22:42.965
with one or two sentences?
547
00:22:43.025 --> 00:22:45.605
Can you build on it? The simplest thing,
548
00:22:45.835 --> 00:22:47.405
this is the hack of the hacks.
549
00:22:47.945 --> 00:22:50.205
If they have written something in their caption
550
00:22:50.435 --> 00:22:52.045
that you can literally pull out
551
00:22:52.105 --> 00:22:54.325
and like re-quote it back to them and say, so
552
00:22:54.325 --> 00:22:57.045
and so I love this part here that you just said,
553
00:22:57.545 --> 00:22:59.805
and then add one little piece done.
554
00:23:00.585 --> 00:23:04.165
But if you can do that a couple times a week, five,
555
00:23:04.185 --> 00:23:07.125
10 minutes, like doesn't need to be crazy, just really start
556
00:23:07.725 --> 00:23:08.925
engaging with the platform.
557
00:23:09.505 --> 00:23:13.445
And that will help you also just not just get found,
558
00:23:13.585 --> 00:23:15.045
but like show up in a way
559
00:23:15.245 --> 00:23:17.325
that somebody's gonna maybe pay more attention to you
560
00:23:17.425 --> 00:23:18.565
and if there's a job there
561
00:23:18.665 --> 00:23:20.525
or if they recognize you,
562
00:23:20.785 --> 00:23:23.325
it just is gonna put you more in the conversation
563
00:23:23.585 --> 00:23:24.885
as opposed to on the sidelines.
564
00:23:25.525 --> 00:23:29.645
I love that. So I would love to get your hot take on
565
00:23:30.355 --> 00:23:35.005
kind of sharing without oversharing how to be kind
566
00:23:35.005 --> 00:23:38.165
of authentic but also feel professional.
567
00:23:38.485 --> 00:23:40.605
I know, and listen, everybody has their
568
00:23:40.665 --> 00:23:41.725
own vibe on LinkedIn.
569
00:23:41.925 --> 00:23:43.325
I know for me personally,
570
00:23:44.265 --> 00:23:46.975
my biggest challenge is when people post photos
571
00:23:47.035 --> 00:23:51.535
of themselves crying and saying I was crying and I'm,
572
00:23:52.195 --> 00:23:54.535
and I don't mean to be disrespectful
573
00:23:54.535 --> 00:23:56.255
because honestly that's your thing.
574
00:23:56.435 --> 00:23:58.415
Let that be your thing. That would
575
00:23:58.415 --> 00:23:59.575
not be comfortable for me.
576
00:23:59.995 --> 00:24:01.895
But if I wanna show up in a way
577
00:24:01.895 --> 00:24:03.495
that's showing my vulnerability
578
00:24:03.915 --> 00:24:06.135
but without feeling like I'm performing
579
00:24:06.195 --> 00:24:09.295
or oversharing, how do you counsel people on that?
580
00:24:09.815 --> 00:24:11.135
I do think there's a fine line
581
00:24:11.135 --> 00:24:12.615
and I'm not always sure where it is.
582
00:24:12.815 --> 00:24:14.695
I think it is an individual thing, right?
583
00:24:14.695 --> 00:24:16.255
There was, it's funny you mentioned the crying
584
00:24:16.495 --> 00:24:18.415
'cause there was like the crying CEOA couple years ago
585
00:24:18.415 --> 00:24:22.135
that got slammed 'cause it felt performative, right?
586
00:24:22.325 --> 00:24:24.335
It's one thing to cry and be genuine
587
00:24:25.275 --> 00:24:27.775
and people can connect to emotion
588
00:24:28.075 --> 00:24:31.015
and there's another for it to seem like you're doing it
589
00:24:31.155 --> 00:24:32.975
for attention or for the wrong reasons.
590
00:24:33.835 --> 00:24:35.455
And I mean, I think
591
00:24:35.455 --> 00:24:36.935
that comes from the type of person you are.
592
00:24:36.935 --> 00:24:38.895
You're either being genuine or you're not.
593
00:24:39.315 --> 00:24:41.175
And a audiences are very smart
594
00:24:41.195 --> 00:24:42.455
and they're gonna figure that out.
595
00:24:43.195 --> 00:24:46.135
So I think it comes down
596
00:24:46.475 --> 00:24:48.855
to why are you doing this, right?
597
00:24:48.855 --> 00:24:50.415
If you're just doing it because you're like,
598
00:24:50.455 --> 00:24:52.895
I just want people to like feel sorry for me,
599
00:24:52.965 --> 00:24:54.055
then that's not a good reason.
600
00:24:54.115 --> 00:24:55.535
If there's a lesson to be learned
601
00:24:55.875 --> 00:24:58.535
or you need support, people love that.
602
00:24:58.565 --> 00:25:00.215
Like I think if you're really struggling
603
00:25:00.215 --> 00:25:01.855
and you're like, Hey, real talk, I need
604
00:25:01.855 --> 00:25:04.215
to like tell people what's going on that a lot
605
00:25:04.215 --> 00:25:06.175
of people will jump in because that feels genuine.
606
00:25:07.155 --> 00:25:08.255
You know? I think it's like you
607
00:25:08.255 --> 00:25:09.295
have to use your best judgment.
608
00:25:09.995 --> 00:25:12.895
Um, if you're not someone who cries on platforms
609
00:25:12.895 --> 00:25:15.135
and don't do that, like, I would never, that's just not me.
610
00:25:15.165 --> 00:25:17.495
Like you, I would never post a crying picture of myself.
611
00:25:17.495 --> 00:25:19.455
But like, I like to joke that I don't have tears.
612
00:25:19.835 --> 00:25:23.015
So, um, you know, doesn't mean I don't feel,
613
00:25:23.435 --> 00:25:24.655
but, um, my friends
614
00:25:24.655 --> 00:25:26.215
and I say I don't have tear ducts, so
615
00:25:26.245 --> 00:25:27.575
that wouldn't be something I would do.
616
00:25:27.675 --> 00:25:30.695
But I can be vulnerable when things go wrong
617
00:25:30.955 --> 00:25:33.055
and say, Hey, I'm not perfect and I ed up
618
00:25:33.055 --> 00:25:35.015
and you know, it's like a peek behind the curtain.
619
00:25:35.885 --> 00:25:38.855
Yeah. Um, but it's also, if
620
00:25:38.855 --> 00:25:40.375
that's not your thing, then you don't have to do that.
621
00:25:40.375 --> 00:25:41.895
Like, I don't think everything about
622
00:25:41.895 --> 00:25:43.255
branding has to be vulnerable.
623
00:25:43.605 --> 00:25:44.775
It's just like, who are you?
624
00:25:44.795 --> 00:25:46.575
And it could be that you're a more positive person
625
00:25:46.675 --> 00:25:48.735
and you're always kind of, and you're kind of woo.
626
00:25:49.035 --> 00:25:50.415
And there's a lot of wooey people
627
00:25:50.435 --> 00:25:51.615
out there and like, good for them.
628
00:25:52.055 --> 00:25:54.895
I say, I'm woo adjacent, so I'm gonna be next to you,
629
00:25:54.915 --> 00:25:56.375
but I'm never gonna go full woo.
630
00:25:56.995 --> 00:25:58.095
But I think you do you
631
00:25:58.515 --> 00:26:00.895
and you have to be like, this is who I am.
632
00:26:00.895 --> 00:26:03.695
Take it or leave it. And I think if you do that,
633
00:26:03.695 --> 00:26:05.295
you're gonna find the right people for sure.
634
00:26:05.765 --> 00:26:08.415
Yeah. That, that totally lands for me.
635
00:26:08.815 --> 00:26:11.295
I will say one of the, the types of posts
636
00:26:11.295 --> 00:26:13.495
that I've started seeing in the past couple years,
637
00:26:13.635 --> 00:26:15.575
and I don't think you ever would've seen this a few years
638
00:26:15.635 --> 00:26:18.935
ago, was people started putting themselves out there in a
639
00:26:18.935 --> 00:26:22.135
way where they've said, listen, LinkedIn, I I,
640
00:26:22.335 --> 00:26:23.495
I lost my job a year ago
641
00:26:23.835 --> 00:26:26.695
and I'm having an incredibly hard time.
642
00:26:27.035 --> 00:26:29.175
Yes. Um, and here's a little bit about me
643
00:26:29.355 --> 00:26:30.495
and if anybody knows anybody,
644
00:26:30.715 --> 00:26:34.255
and you know, that type of post where it's not performative,
645
00:26:34.275 --> 00:26:35.295
but it's so honest.
646
00:26:35.395 --> 00:26:36.815
Yes. Like when you're, when you're ready
647
00:26:36.815 --> 00:26:38.015
to get past the whole, no,
648
00:26:38.015 --> 00:26:39.415
everything's great, I'm doing great.
649
00:26:39.415 --> 00:26:41.535
Everybody's calling me for interviews
650
00:26:41.595 --> 00:26:43.805
and just being willing to say, you know what, I,
651
00:26:43.905 --> 00:26:45.245
I'm actually having a really hard time.
652
00:26:45.245 --> 00:26:47.645
Yeah. And if anybody, well I'm, you know, and,
653
00:26:47.785 --> 00:26:50.565
and yes, you need to strike that balance of not being
654
00:26:50.565 --> 00:26:51.565
Desperate, right?
655
00:26:51.565 --> 00:26:53.325
Yes, correct.
Yes. Being
656
00:26:53.325 --> 00:26:55.405
Vulnerable and letting your community know
657
00:26:55.405 --> 00:26:56.805
that you could use support.
658
00:26:56.985 --> 00:26:58.645
And when people who know you
659
00:26:58.705 --> 00:27:01.885
or have experienced your work in some way see that post,
660
00:27:02.315 --> 00:27:03.925
they may share it for amplification.
661
00:27:03.955 --> 00:27:06.125
They may offer you an endorsement. Yes.
662
00:27:06.685 --> 00:27:09.925
I find that people, people like to help people,
663
00:27:10.425 --> 00:27:12.165
but if people dunno, you need help,
664
00:27:12.315 --> 00:27:13.725
they don't think to offer it.
665
00:27:13.825 --> 00:27:17.125
And so having the courage to ask for it in ways that feel
666
00:27:17.715 --> 00:27:20.205
safe for you, I can be really powerful.
667
00:27:20.925 --> 00:27:21.925
I totally agree.
668
00:27:22.065 --> 00:27:24.485
And I think, you know, there's this crazy like mistaken
669
00:27:24.545 --> 00:27:26.405
notion from a lot of people who say like,
670
00:27:26.425 --> 00:27:28.085
should I put the open to work?
671
00:27:28.585 --> 00:27:30.605
Uh, you know, uh, graphic on my photo?
672
00:27:31.065 --> 00:27:33.285
And a lot of people in like groups are like, no,
673
00:27:33.285 --> 00:27:34.445
because that shows you're desperate.
674
00:27:34.865 --> 00:27:37.285
I'm like, no, no. It just lets recruiters know you're open
675
00:27:37.285 --> 00:27:39.765
to work, you're making their job easier for them.
676
00:27:40.185 --> 00:27:42.445
Why would you not do that? Right.
677
00:27:42.665 --> 00:27:45.365
And there's no shame in looking for work, right?
678
00:27:45.365 --> 00:27:48.605
To your point, it's, Hey, I'm outta work and I'm available
679
00:27:48.745 --> 00:27:50.045
and look how talented I am
680
00:27:50.185 --> 00:27:52.125
and wouldn't you want to come interview me?
681
00:27:52.625 --> 00:27:55.645
So I think it's a lot of just changing the narrative
682
00:27:55.745 --> 00:27:57.045
around what that is.
683
00:27:57.185 --> 00:27:59.085
If if you think it's gonna come across desperate,
684
00:27:59.085 --> 00:28:00.325
then you're not in the right mindset.
685
00:28:00.945 --> 00:28:02.685
But if you're like, no, I'm open to work
686
00:28:02.785 --> 00:28:05.885
and I'm looking for a job, then you should be proud
687
00:28:05.885 --> 00:28:07.085
to say, Hey, I'm looking for work.
688
00:28:07.545 --> 00:28:09.405
And then to your point, ask your community
689
00:28:09.425 --> 00:28:10.525
to say, Hey, I'm looking for work.
690
00:28:10.725 --> 00:28:13.085
'cause I do think to your point, everyone does want to help
691
00:28:13.585 --> 00:28:15.045
and we don't always know how.
692
00:28:15.625 --> 00:28:18.045
So if somebody's like, Hey, I'm looking to connect
693
00:28:18.045 --> 00:28:20.045
with this company, or if anybody knows anyone at this
694
00:28:20.045 --> 00:28:22.365
company, that's easy for someone to do.
695
00:28:22.385 --> 00:28:24.205
If you're just like, Hey, I'm looking for a job.
696
00:28:24.785 --> 00:28:26.445
If you know anyone, it's vague.
697
00:28:26.665 --> 00:28:29.805
So specificity is always your friend in the ask,
698
00:28:30.075 --> 00:28:32.685
just like it is when with your brand you wanna be specific.
699
00:28:32.985 --> 00:28:35.645
Really nicely said. All right.
700
00:28:35.685 --> 00:28:36.845
I have one more question for you
701
00:28:36.905 --> 00:28:39.325
and then I wanna see if there's anything I haven't hit on.
702
00:28:39.515 --> 00:28:40.765
Okay. Can we just talk
703
00:28:40.765 --> 00:28:43.205
for a minute about different career stages
704
00:28:43.945 --> 00:28:48.045
and how, if at all people should evolve their personal
705
00:28:48.045 --> 00:28:52.045
branding strategies if they are kind of young and new and,
706
00:28:52.045 --> 00:28:54.485
and just coming into the job market or maybe coming back
707
00:28:54.485 --> 00:28:58.205
after a hiatus versus, you know, they're more, more tenured,
708
00:28:58.205 --> 00:28:59.205
more executive level.
709
00:28:59.865 --> 00:29:00.965
Um, any thoughts there?
710
00:29:01.195 --> 00:29:03.965
Yeah, I mean, just like we evolve as people,
711
00:29:04.265 --> 00:29:06.525
our quote unquote brands evolve over time.
712
00:29:07.025 --> 00:29:08.485
And one of the things that, I talk to a lot
713
00:29:08.485 --> 00:29:11.405
of students a lot and like people interning
714
00:29:11.785 --> 00:29:14.085
and I always say like, it's, you're in, it's nice
715
00:29:14.085 --> 00:29:15.085
to be in on the ground floor
716
00:29:15.405 --> 00:29:17.645
'cause you get to kind of decide who you wanna be right now,
717
00:29:17.785 --> 00:29:19.525
but that's probably not who you're gonna be in five
718
00:29:19.525 --> 00:29:20.685
years, 10 years, 20 years.
719
00:29:21.145 --> 00:29:23.405
And also, like, you don't have a lot of experience.
720
00:29:23.465 --> 00:29:26.125
You know, I have a almost 20-year-old son
721
00:29:26.385 --> 00:29:28.205
and you know, he doesn't really have a
722
00:29:28.255 --> 00:29:29.325
brand yet professionally.
723
00:29:29.605 --> 00:29:30.925
'cause he's had like a few jobs.
724
00:29:30.955 --> 00:29:32.725
Like he had been a referee, worked at camp,
725
00:29:33.065 --> 00:29:34.085
you know, what's his brand?
726
00:29:34.185 --> 00:29:35.445
But he's very sports oriented.
727
00:29:35.445 --> 00:29:38.485
He's very quiet so that he might wanna convey
728
00:29:38.485 --> 00:29:40.325
that he's a little bit more of a quiet person
729
00:29:40.465 --> 00:29:43.805
and find a fit where he is not gonna be, you know,
730
00:29:43.805 --> 00:29:45.365
handed a microphone or something.
731
00:29:45.365 --> 00:29:47.045
Like he's not gonna be a commentator.
732
00:29:47.505 --> 00:29:49.445
So he has to put that out there.
733
00:29:50.025 --> 00:29:53.405
But then as you evolve, again, I think it's like a matter
734
00:29:53.405 --> 00:29:55.445
of shedding what no longer serves you.
735
00:29:55.985 --> 00:29:59.205
And every few years we should kind of do like a brand audit
736
00:29:59.465 --> 00:30:01.565
for ourselves and like, look at your profile
737
00:30:01.585 --> 00:30:04.125
and look at how you're showing up and if you're stuck
738
00:30:04.145 --> 00:30:06.885
or you're struggling or even if you're ready to like go
739
00:30:06.885 --> 00:30:09.565
to the next level, what are you, what is the message
740
00:30:09.595 --> 00:30:11.565
that your profile or your bio is sending?
741
00:30:11.905 --> 00:30:13.925
And how do you elevate that for what's next?
742
00:30:14.545 --> 00:30:17.045
And I get a lot of people who are like, I just been promoted
743
00:30:17.265 --> 00:30:19.645
and now I need to like, show up as a different type
744
00:30:19.645 --> 00:30:20.925
of person, or I need to take more
745
00:30:20.925 --> 00:30:22.285
leadership or more ownership.
746
00:30:22.385 --> 00:30:25.565
And I don't even talk about any of that in my bio.
747
00:30:26.305 --> 00:30:29.405
So I think at each stage it's really important
748
00:30:29.425 --> 00:30:31.365
to think about what you've accomplished
749
00:30:31.385 --> 00:30:32.405
and then where do you wanna go
750
00:30:32.825 --> 00:30:37.445
and revise in order to hit those marks and metrics.
751
00:30:38.515 --> 00:30:40.565
Nice. Really nicely said. Thank you.
752
00:30:40.615 --> 00:30:44.925
Thank you.
So Danielle, I I wanna be respectful
753
00:30:44.925 --> 00:30:47.725
of your time, but as we start to bring this to a close,
754
00:30:47.945 --> 00:30:49.965
is there anything that I haven't asked you
755
00:30:50.025 --> 00:30:53.085
or that just feels important to share for anybody who
756
00:30:53.945 --> 00:30:56.725
is listening and thinking, I really need
757
00:30:56.725 --> 00:30:59.285
to start upping my game on the LinkedIn ?
758
00:30:59.925 --> 00:31:01.805
I think, you know, the, the, the thing I always tell
759
00:31:01.805 --> 00:31:04.085
people is baby steps, right?
760
00:31:04.085 --> 00:31:06.565
Don't, I'm not telling you to blow up your whole bio
761
00:31:06.825 --> 00:31:09.685
and like completely, you know, again, like step out
762
00:31:09.685 --> 00:31:12.525
of the spotlight and share all the things, you know,
763
00:31:12.555 --> 00:31:14.085
what is something you're really proud of?
764
00:31:14.085 --> 00:31:15.725
What is one thing you wanna be known for?
765
00:31:16.135 --> 00:31:18.685
Could you at the very least just put that hobby at the end
766
00:31:18.685 --> 00:31:20.285
of your title and see how that feels?
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00:31:20.865 --> 00:31:22.485
You know, I've had clients do
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00:31:22.485 --> 00:31:24.645
that who've only felt comfortable with that.
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00:31:24.745 --> 00:31:26.405
And then they call me and they say, oh my God,
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00:31:26.405 --> 00:31:27.605
everybody wants to know about
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00:31:27.785 --> 00:31:28.965
the fact that I'm a marathon runner.
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00:31:28.965 --> 00:31:31.365
Or I get so many people reaching out about the hobby
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00:31:31.365 --> 00:31:35.245
that I put up and it just opens the door to conversation.
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00:31:35.905 --> 00:31:38.965
So for anyone who's just unsure, just baby steps, just
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00:31:38.965 --> 00:31:40.925
what can you infuse, see how it feels
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00:31:41.345 --> 00:31:43.605
and you know, you might realize that the more you do it,
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00:31:43.605 --> 00:31:44.685
the more comfortable you get.
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00:31:44.685 --> 00:31:45.725
Like anything, right?
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00:31:45.725 --> 00:31:48.085
We're not gonna come out fully baked, you know,
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00:31:48.085 --> 00:31:50.525
we're a little bit of a raw cookie dough right now
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00:31:50.945 --> 00:31:53.445
and you know, you will get it to be this beautiful,
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00:31:53.445 --> 00:31:54.925
delicious, big piping hot cookie.
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00:31:55.105 --> 00:31:56.965
But for now we're gonna just start with the mix
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00:31:57.025 --> 00:31:58.405
and the batter, so.
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00:31:58.825 --> 00:32:02.365
Wow. But I do aspire to be a beautiful, hot,
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00:32:02.365 --> 00:32:04.925
delicious cookie, so thank you for that. Of
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00:32:04.925 --> 00:32:05.925
Course, of course.
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00:32:06.185 --> 00:32:09.485
So Danielle, if people are interested,
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00:32:09.565 --> 00:32:11.245
they wanna learn more about you, about
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00:32:11.345 --> 00:32:12.925
how they might be able to work with you,
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00:32:13.335 --> 00:32:14.485
where can we send them?
792
00:32:15.145 --> 00:32:17.725
So obviously they can go to my LinkedIn, uh,
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00:32:17.725 --> 00:32:19.085
which is just Danielle Hughes.
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00:32:19.145 --> 00:32:20.405
I'm sure you'll put that in the show notes.
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00:32:20.675 --> 00:32:24.045
I'll, and then my website is more than words copy.com
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00:32:24.865 --> 00:32:26.325
and that's the best place to find me.
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00:32:26.365 --> 00:32:28.485
I have a newsletter that goes out every two weeks,
798
00:32:29.105 --> 00:32:30.245
the best way to stay in touch,
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00:32:30.305 --> 00:32:33.005
and then I'm happy to share all the ways that I can help.
800
00:32:33.235 --> 00:32:35.405
Amazing. Thank you so much, Danielle.
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00:32:35.405 --> 00:32:36.525
It has been a pleasure.
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00:32:36.815 --> 00:32:37.965
Thank you so much, Rachel.
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00:32:38.515 --> 00:32:39.805
Take care. Bye.
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00:32:40.955 --> 00:32:43.435
I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Danielle Hughes
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00:32:43.495 --> 00:32:46.075
and that you're feeling inspired to hit LinkedIn hard
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00:32:46.655 --> 00:32:49.475
If you could use a boost, she offers some great workshops.
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00:32:49.745 --> 00:32:51.195
Find the links in the show notes.
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00:32:51.905 --> 00:32:53.475
Join me next week for another great
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00:32:53.475 --> 00:32:54.515
episode of Modern Mentor.
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00:32:55.005 --> 00:32:58.195
Until then, visit my website@leadabovenoise.com
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and follow Modern Mentor on Apple Podcasts, Spotify,
812
00:33:01.375 --> 00:33:02.475
or wherever you listen.
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00:33:03.135 --> 00:33:05.995
Thanks so much for listening and have a successful week.
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00:33:06.455 --> 00:33:08.875
And hey, don't forget to leave a rating or review.
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00:33:09.375 --> 00:33:11.515
Modern Mentor is a quick and Dirty Tips podcast.
816
00:33:12.065 --> 00:33:13.835
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00:33:14.295 --> 00:33:16.795
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